gated shifter

[kbee00]

So I searched for a gated shifter thread - found one from last year - but it went dead. One pic of gated car - no idea what that was, what with all the gauges, etc.

I am going do this mod as it fits perfectly with the theme, the make, and the "feel" of an Italian sports car. What I can't understand is why this isn't more of a talking topic.....must be me.

Anyone care to chime in why or why not do this mod? We have some very enterprising young people (and old) that could take this and run with it. If not, I will have to test the waters myself....

Thanks

LT

[baltobernie]

I drove an Audi R8 when it was first introduced, with a gated shifter. I hated it (the shifter ... not the car). Hard on the wrist and terribly slow (the shifter ... not the car)

[maytag]

I like gated shifters, when done correctly. and I agree that they 'feel right' in an Italian car. You're right, they slow the shift-motion.... but I'll trade that for the positive-shift feel anytime. the speed with which you shift between gears is rarely important... and ALWAYS hard on parts.

[TX82FIAT]

If you fabricate something a few things come to mind. Make sure you have the shifting pattern lined up correctly. You may need to modify the shifter (shorter throw and a thinner shaft). I would also wonder about the gated shifter attachment point. Gated shifter on the center console and shift lever mounted to transmission may not line up as you push through the geart during spirited driving. Boot gives you the feel to hit the gears and a large margine for error. Lastly, i'm not sure the feal would be the same. With all that said.

It would look really cool!!!! In fact, if a few people did this mod and it worked well i would be all in!!

[Strace]

I'm definitely interested and plan on trying it out on my Spider project soon.

[grittracing]

i would be interested in any thing you come up with might even buy 2. Looked on ebay at the gated shifter gates for other makes,such as ferrari thought about trying to bolt one in place tempary to see how it would work or not. But to many irons in the fire currently and no time. Please keep us posted

[kbee00]

There are a couple of ways I think to approach this. The simply D&D way would be to just let the shift rod ride in the slots - this would require some level of slop to allow for inconsistencies in the tranny - and would not offer much more than bling.

The better way would be to actually encase the shift rod in a bearing - probably Delrin or Nylon - and have this bearing follow a groove in the gate.

I realize that shift speed would decrease - but synchros don't like fast shifts anyway (especially on the way down) - so I don't see this as a detrement. In fact there is nothing like the sound of a well executed double clutch downshift - practice makes perfect!!

I am not going to be working on this project in the near future - I have much to do with the body first. But, I will keep the topic book marked and when I get a chance to put some resources on it, I will post my work.

Meanwhile, those that can offer insight -please do not hesitate to bring your thoughts to bear.

LT

[opus10583]

There are a couple of ways I think to approach this. The simply D&D way would be to just let the shift rod ride in the slots - this would require some level of slop to allow for inconsistencies in the tranny - and would not offer much more than bling.

[...]

Meanwhile, those that can offer insight -please do not hesitate to bring your thoughts to bear.

Hi,

No matter how you execute this it will not be more than bling, and will result in unanticipated stresses on your shifter and perhaps shifting mechanisms that could lead to premature failures.

A shift gate imposes control of the forces and movements of the shifting elements and mechanisms allowing them to be designed to finer limits, reducing transmission weight while maintaining durability.

Adding a gate to a shifter and transmission mechanisms not originally designed for one adds weight and a source of forces that were neither considered nor anticipated in either's design and engineering.

IMHO,
Mark

[maytag]

Hi,

No matter how you execute this it will not be more than bling, and will result in unanticipated stresses on your shifter and perhaps shifting mechanisms that could lead to premature failures.

A shift gate imposes control of the forces and movements of the shifting elements and mechanisms allowing them to be designed to finer limits, reducing transmission weight while maintaining durability.

Adding a gate to a shifter and transmission mechanisms not originally designed for one adds weight and a source of forces that were neither considered nor anticipated in either's design and engineering.

IMHO,
Mark

WOW.

[124ADDHE]

I gotta call BS. A gate for your shifter will impose no additional wear other than the points where the shift leaver actually contacts the gate. I made one out of plywood a few years ago in anticipation of having one made out of aluminium on a cnc rig.

would look super cool! I built a pedastal for mine and ditched the center consol (still have it gone for that day when I have the time....but now that you have refired the idea in my head, maybe that is one of the next projects

[opus10583]

I gotta call BS. A gate for your shifter will impose no additional wear other than the points where the shift leaver actually contacts the gate. I made one out of plywood a few years ago in anticipation of having one made out of aluminium on a cnc rig.

would look super cool! I built a pedastal for mine and ditched the center consol (still have it gone for that day when I have the time....but now that you have refired the idea in my head, maybe that is one of the next projects

It's not wear, but rather where...

As an add-on to a conventional shifter the gate creates a fulcrum through which unanticipated and uncompensated stresses are imparted to the shifter mechanism, and perhaps then to the shifting mechanisms.

YMMV,
Mark

[leftfield6]

To each his own, but isn't this truly a case of form over function?

I too am woefully short of supercar seat time, but is there a real advantage to a gated shifter mod for a car not designed for it? IMHO, having a shifter gate at the height of the console would necessitate having such wide slot tracks for the shifter to move through that it would be useless. I think it's too far from the pivot point of the shifter, which is down at the plastic ball and cup assembly, to be effective.

If someone can prove me wrong, it would be cool, but I put this into the category of bling. Kind of like a giant wing on the back of a front wheel drive Honda Civic.

Good discussion on Miata.net about this topic here: http://forum.miata.net/vb/showthread.php?t=332861

[opus10583]

[...]
I too am woefully short of supercar seat time, but is there a real advantage to a gated shifter mod for a car not designed for it? [...]

No, and probably not since the 308-series Ferraris, certainly not the manual version of any car that has a electrohydraulic actuated single clutch semi-auto gearbox.

The boys at Car & Driver have snapped the shift lever of at least two contemporary Lamborghini's, illustrating one anticipated result of a purely cosmetic shift gate.

Ciao,
Mark

[manoa matt]

I think Mark is on to something with the "stress on the shifter" topic. There are service letters from Fiat and recommendations from may of the old timers "Don't rest your hand on the shifter unless you are actually shifting gears, as resting your hand on the shifter causes premature wear on the shifter forks." If the gate is not properly sized, and the shifter is in constant contact with the side of the gate, it will cause premature wear of the shifter forks.

Another thing to note is the trans and engine are on rubber mounts so they torque, twist, rotate, and shake independently of the body. You may likely end up with a constant ringing/rattle as the shifter chatters against the side of the gate. Also the movement of the trans will invariably lead to contact of the shifter on the side of the gate, inducing a load, (similar to resting your hand on the shifter) which could lead to premature wear of the internal trans components.

Bling, bling, or an expensive transmission rebuild?

[opus10583]

Bling, bling, or an expensive transmission rebuild?

Indeed. I'm all for bling; I bought a new top cover while my car was on jack stands being made safe for bridge expansion joints, bought an oil pressure gauge on eBay that I can't use* and which was previously declared useless by no-less than FIAT themselves; but adding a shift gate, not a FIAT tradition, not uniquely an Italian tradition - BTW, to a FIAT Spider transmission shifter is a prescription for premature failure of reliability-affective systems.

Ciao,
Mark

*Yours, for 70% of what I paid, shipping included, never installed, never powered by me: PM me.