Who's car is this...?

[Holshot]

Hey guys I'm trying to track down the owner of this car... It's the only pic I have unfortunately but since it is a pretty unique setup it maybe someone here or someone who may know of said car. I'm really after finding out what intake manifold he is running but would love to chat with him about the car in general since this is the path I plan on going. It would appear to be from a "newer" model Fiat that happens to bolt up to the Spider head. If anyone knows and can help I would be greatly appreciative!

Kind Regards,
Giuseppe

[burgandy81]

not sure whose car that is but the manifold looks a little like the one I am using.

A few more details here http://www.turbo124.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=7405

You will see in the thread that I am not exactly sure which manifold it is. I bought if off ebay and the Ausies say it is not as described. it is probably from a Lancia.

I have another that interferes with the cam wheels a little. A man more skilled than I could cut the TB mount and change to the appropriate angle. How are your aluminum skills? Got a talented friend?

An interesting example here http://www.fiat-abarth.co.uk/124%20prep4%20news.htm

[Holshot]

Thanks Burgandy for the helpful links! Interesting options... I'm not sure if you clicked on the pic I posted to see the full shot of the engine bat and could get a better look at the one I'm after but after looking at the links you sent me I don't they are the same but I could be wrong. The one I have included looks different and I've ruled out something custom as a Sheetmetal deal because you can obviously see its a cast piece but possibly modified by a skilled aluminum welder and blended all the cuts and welds to angle the TB to to clear the cam gears/boxes. I'm going to still try and find where I found this pic and hopefully find out whose car this is and hopefully pick his brain some... Thanks again for the help!

Kind Regards,
Giuseppe

[burgandy81]

hi Giuseppe,

No, I had not clicked the image! I just did, and now have a better understanding.

With the larger view I DO think it is similar to my manifold. I believe the unit on the yellow car has been cut and re-welded, notice the slight discoloration of the cast aluminum between the manifold body and the TB mount. This may be the result of grinding welds. From memory the Lancia Dedra?? was the only car with a straight manifold/TB set up. Maybe one of our international readers can comment?

I am very interested to learn more about this yellow car. The exhaust manifold interests me as it appears to be a modified stock spider FI exhaust manifold.

Best of luck! Keep us posted!

[manoa matt]

Try asking on this forum: http://turbo124.com/forum/ It's an Australian forum, they imported other models of fiats there and the guys got parts that we in the US don't. Those blokes build some pretty wild stuff.

[Holshot]

Hey Steve, I didn't know how to shrink it down and it figures when I uploaded the original pic it cut off the very side I was trying to illustrate. I'm glad I mentioned it and you clicked on the pic and could see a better shot of the whole engine bay... If you can post a pick up of the manifold you have so I can see it first hand if you don't mind and tell me where you were able to find it as that was a car that was never imported here in the States and if you don't mind what did you pay for it? I'm going to include a few pics of the idea I had on the exhaust side of the equation. I thought about using a 4 -1 manifold and hack off the Fiat donut flange and weld on a Tial V-Band flange.

Here's my thought process on choosing this style turbine exhaust housing: first, the diameters are very, very close and to make a perfect fit would only require very little blending to keep a really nice flow and no big pressure changes and reversion going from that smaller round hole (fiat side) to a larger squared T- 4 style flange. Second, The Tial exhaust housing/flange has been proven time and time again on the dyno to improve spool/lag response over its equal size turbine exhaust housing in a T-4 and is good for a few horsepower as well. Not that these cars will ever see the kind of power I'm used to making in other applications I've worked on over the years but its nice stuff with practical uses which can be applied to even smaller projects Third, it will clean up the engine bay quite a bit and makes for easier turbo placement since it has a much smaller footprint from its T-4 brethren and can be clocked to any position you need unlike a traditional 4 bolt setup on almost all standard turbos.

Now I know some people will say that you can't weld to cast... You can, it's just not usually done because if not done properly it will just snap off. You have to really get the cast part you will be welding to really, really hot first before you even think about welding to and then it would always be a good idea to brace the weight to help with the stress and strain that a 20lb turbo will be applying to the welded area. Worst case scenario we just build a nice tubular manifold and call it quits. If there's enough demand for it I may put up some money and contact a fabricator I know and have a run made...



Tial V-Band flange



Complete turbo



This is a tubular exhaust manifold off a Miata w/ a Garrett T-28 turbo but using a Tial exhaust housing instead of the standard T-4 square flange housing

[Holshot]

Try asking on this forum: http://turbo124.com/forum/ It's an Australian forum, they imported other models of fiats there and the guys got parts that we in the US don't. Those blokes build some pretty wild stuff.

Thanks Matt, I think I will do that and most likely if that's the way to I'll have to most likely source it from them since that motor never came in anything over here in the States. Cheers!

[Holshot]

Another idea I had was trying a carb setup for the simplicity of not having to wire in a stand alone engine management system and have the hassle of a lot of the tuning associated with FI setups... I know it's a double negative saying simplicity and then turbo charging a Fiat carb setup... But I like challenge to certain degree and think it would be "neat" to try it since its something I've never seen before on a Fiat. I've sent off an email to these guys in California called CSU, now these guys are the kings when it comes to blow through carb setups with big blocks and muscles cars but their knowledge could be applied to us possibly... Now I'll be the first to say I have know idea when it comes to carbs and such especially our setup but what they are able to do with a Holley carb is just about insane. Here's a link to very interesting article about the work they do:

http://www.enginelabs.com/engine-tech/c ... rburetors/

Their site and some of the cars they have worked their magic on:

http://www.csucarbs.com/

I've looked at the single plane manifolds and thought about the possibility of grafting a Holley (overkill I'm sure) to it that way we could use an bonnet setup similar to some of these or possibly have the weber modified applying the same concepts and mods they do to the Holleys but then I don't know how we could seal it up for boost as I haven't found anything bonnet wise that would fit a Weber carb. That's not to say its not out there it's just I haven't found it yet...

[Holshot]

Forgot to mention that going to a Tial will also force the use of an external wastegate and you would not be able to use an internally gated style turbo but that's not necessarily a bad thing just a little overkill (external) depending how much power you're trying to make and would obviously add to the end cost. There are some really nice internally gated turbos that would work very well for this motor which would eliminate the need of the external wastegate. But then we are right back to the beginning trying to put a square peg in a round hole so to speak. If you want to try using the stock exhaust manifold Tial would be the way to go but if that wasn't the case and building a manifold from scratch then a standard 4 bolt flange turbo would be ultimately cheaper I think...? Decisions, decisions, decisions! Hahaha...

[PittsburghKevin]

Holshot, would the later 16v turbo exhaust manifold fit on the 8v block? something like this? more money, less work and made for the task? Could compare gaskets maybe to see if it will bolt up.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Abgaskrummer- ... 5d3a51268f

[Holshot]

Hey Kevin,

I have no idea but that's a great idea about trying to match up gaskets to see if they are a match... But one thing I noticed and don't like is how far forward this puts the turbo which I believe will most definitely interfere the coolant pipe not to mention it will then be hard for an intake/fitter setup. Still worth looking into none the less, hopefully someone can chime in but perhaps the thread title will prevent many from either bothering to venture into this thread and now that its starting to take a more technical turn it's ashame that we probably won't get the responses we're after.

Kind Regards,
Giuseppe

[PittsburghKevin]

Giuseppe, we can start another thread with the specific question. This is about what it looks like mounted:

[PittsburghKevin]

Let me be more clear, that is what a similar one looks like mounted.