looking at first fiat HELP

[taylor120]

Hello!
I have looked though the posts on what to look for in a good car, and both of these are rust free. So with that out of the way I'm looking for more of an experienced opinion on the differences between these two cars.

First is a 1981 Fiat Spider 2000 with 43,000 miles. top has a small rip, heater control valve is leaking, driver side lock tumbler is missing, needs tires, and the dash is cracked. The paint also has a few small chips and scratches all over. The rear bumper was also hit and will need replaced.

The second is a 1975 Fiat, he said it was a 120, but I think he meant 124. Did they make a 120? He had the Engine and drive shaft rebuilt 3 years ago with receipts. The top, paint, interior, tires are all in good shape. I would say this car doesn't really need anything to make a great driver, but not a 100% finished show car.

So at first you might say the second one is the clear winner, but the first one I can pick up for $1600. The other one for about $2600. I like the looks of the '81 better, but I prefer carbereted over EFI due to less potential problems. I would like to know if I am wrong here, I assume the injected version would be more prone to problems. Also, the '81 is automatic, and although I want a stick, the ball and chain want an auto. Also, do the prices sound reasonable? What else am I missing, and what should I know about these two cars?

I know I'm a newbie here, so excuse my ignorance in advance, but I would appreciate any advice you could give. Both of my parents had fiat spiders when I was a child, and I have always wanted one!
-Mike


**Update** I bought the 81 and things were going fine. Normal maintenance issues until I decided to investigate why the radiator didn't quite fit right. I already had it drained to check the temp sensor and stat, so I thought I would pull it and check what was going on. If a picture speaks a thousand words, what happens if they all happen to be four letter words? Pictures are uploading now…

[aj81spider]

My opinion - which with $1.25 will get you a coffee in my cafeteria:

I would get the one you like better. That said - If it were me I'd get the 75. It sounds like it's in better shape, and replacing a top, tires, dash, and fixing the other things you mention could easily run you the $1000 difference.

The one consideration that would make me rethink is keeping the wife happy. If she's into the car that will help a lot!

If the cars are rust free and running without issues then the prices seem good. Make sure the transmissions are shifting smoothly and don't pop out of any of the gears (that's an expensive rebuild - ask me how I know!).

I have both a FI and a carburated spider and no real experience working on cars. I actually am more comfortable working on the FI one.

Good luck!

[taylor120]

Thank you for the reply!

When the FI's do have problems, what things tend to do wrong? I have read somewhere that inevitably a fiat will leave you stranded on the side of the road. Has this been your experience?

Thanks again

[ga.spyder]

I have an f.i. Spider and I have never been stranded.My carb'd Spider left me stranded 3 time before I finally got the carb right.I had MG's and other sports cars that were far less reliable than the Fiats!The carb cars are easier to modify,the f.i. cars have better driveability.They are both 30+ years old and are going to require some maintenance.All that being said the automatic would be a deal breaker for me.Teach the wife to drive the stick.Can you post some pics of both cars? As far as the price,both are very reasonable.As aj81 said,you will spend more than $1000 to fix the issues on the 81.

[katsi]

I have looked though the posts on what to look for in a good car, and both of these are rust free

Just my 2 cents - I have yet to see a rust free Fiat 124 spider. I don't believe one exists. I too thought mine was rust free - it wasn't. Nothing major and very fixable but NOT rust free - just saying - don't fool yourself there.

First is a 1981 Fiat Spider 2000 with 43,000 miles

Could be 43,000 , 143,000 or 243,000. Ignore mileage on these cars. Could be a new speedo - you never know what a PO has done.

If it doesn't have rust in the right spots then I would go for the 1981 FI for the following reasons.
1) it has a 2000 cc motor in it
2) the 2000 cc motor is a non interrupting motor which means that if the timing belt breaks (and it will) the chances of you doing major damage is considerably less if not compleetly void (it may or may not have the fuel pump loab on the cam for the manual fuel pump - that is the only place it can interrupt in the case of a timimg belt mishap - Yes I realize that it has an electric fuel pump but it still may have the loab on the auxilliary cam that was once used for the manual fuel pump)
3) It's going to have an electronic ignition vs. points distributor.
4) The fuel injection is pretty simple and reliable not to mention they seem to have a few more ponies under the hood.


I hope this helps. Again, Check for rust - their really are no rust free Fiat 124's - Unless someone has already cut and welded in new metal - then maybe

[NJFIAT1981]

Hi Taylor,
I've had 3 FI Spiders without any problems. Where are you located? Maybe someone in your area will lend some assistance and take a look at your spiders with you. George

[azruss]

tried this once and the post didnt take. I drove a spider for 23 years and 295k miles and it only left we stranded once (ign module failed). This was a low budget car maintained on a shoe string. Found these cars to be very reliable. With this age, you want to make sure everything is all worn out. $1600 is low enough that i would expect some issues. hard to find anything under $2500 that doesnt have serious issues.
On the 2 cars, do you have a chance to drive them. there is much to be told here. Do they drive straight and vibration free, brake smooth and even, no heavy exhaust smells from under the hood. do all the lights and gages work. coolant holes not swollen, spew smoke out the back on decompression, doesnt pop out of gear, no excessive whine in diffy, on the one with the heater valve leak, does the floorboard pass the screw driver test, when you bounce the fenders, do the shocks recover right away, is the upper horizontal tube above the shock towers have stress cracks, do wipers work, seat back tight when you shake it, doors dont drop when opened, hows the body work, straight without waves, door and hood gaps even, clarity of windshield, wingnuts still on, frame shows cracks around cross-member mounts and sway bar mounts, oil smell burnt, any "milkshake" on the underside of the oil fill cap, hold temp at idle, oil light stays off at idle, wear on tires are even inside to out, when you run your hand around the tread to you feel any wash boarding and ridging, when you shake the front tires, do you feel play, how much play in the steering wheel at the center position, heater controls work smooth without effort, windows roll up and down without effort and noise, bubbles in paint at the end of the wheel flairs or bottom corner of doors, run hand along the bottom of the door for rust, what does volts to the battery read when running, starter turn with gusto. I could go on and on.

[taylor120]

Wow, thank you everyone for the help. The 75 has been owned by the same man for 25 years, and is very clean. I will take a second look this weekend for more rust. When I say rust free, I mean it may have a small scratch or something, but none of the rust in the shock towers or other trouble areas.

the 81 has been in storage for the last 10 years and has no rust other than the few scratches where they may have opened the door into something or another scratch.
I should have probably said that I have owned many cars, just not of the Italian variety. So I am well aware of the usual suspects here (milky oil, saggy doors, brakes, oil blow by etc) I guess I’m more in search of the fiat specific trouble items.
I'm in NE Ohio, East of Akron/Canton. I can try to post some pictures when I get back tonight.

Thanks again!

(if this double posts I will delete it later, looks like posting is slow for some reason)

[narfire]

Are these the only two you have looked at? If you are not in a hurry, perhaps take a breath after driving those two and just snoop around some more.
I like my FI and a few mods on/in the engine has given it more pop but the Carb'd cars offer more yet.
After paying dick for mine but then investing thousands, I'd be going for a good or better car in the $4-5G range and add to it while you can drive it. They are out there, just have to be paitent.
Chris

[rlux4]

Katsi, if you want to see a rust free Fiat, come out to California. My 82 has no rust, never had any. There are several others in our group here in SoCal. Texas though, it would depend on what part you were in if you wanted to find or keep a rust free Fiat. I was stationed in Corpus Christi in the Navy and remember driving a four door Ford and the post fell through the floor, literally. I'm originally from Washington state, and never saw a Spider until I moved to California in 1980. I think because they must have rusted to pieces between the dealer and the buyer's house. LOL.
Ron

[taylor120]

Ok, so I've never posted pictures to a blog so I'm just put them on my skydrive. Here is the link. They are both in great shape, and don't think I could go wrong. I will get better pictures this weekend when I go back.

http://sdrv.ms/PTiFdi (sorry, I had to edit the folder)

[katsi]

Katsi, if you want to see a rust free Fiat, come out to California.

I grew up in CA and lived in Oceanside. They rust there too. I'm not trying to be a weenie saying that your car is garbage. Just trying to let a potential new Fiat owner in on some of the rust issues inherrent to these cars. The metal used was not the best quality and Fiat did not even attempt to protect these cars from rust. Talk to any of the old timers and they will tell you that back in the day it was not uncommon to find a Fiat rusting on the sales floor. And I bet if you start chipping off some of that gum on the floor boards, you will find lots of rust. My car came from LA (Los Angeles) and I thought it was rust free - after I started cleaning, I found lots of rust. Nothing bad but it was there and needed attention b4 it got bad.

[ga.spyder]

Katsi,I gotta go with Ron.I understand you are trying to warn a new owner of the rust issues that plague these cars.My 82 had no rust,none..anywhere.It was always a Southern car (N.C. and Ga.),probably always garaged and never exposed to road salt.There are some exceptions out there.

[taylor120]

OK, every bad and good thing aside. If you could pick a year/style fiat what would it be and why? Is it for the looks or performance? I think this will open a can of worms, but so far this has been very informative!! Thanks guys

[azruss]

I've had a bunch of 71 and earlier spiders and coupes. my kid had a 75 coupe and i am currently restoring an 80FI.
Alot depends on what you are comfortable with, points or fuel injection. from what i have read here, the FI cars put out a lot of power...requires some pretty good mods on the earlier engines to achieve the same power. If you ever need to pass emissions, it should be easier with an FI car. It is a more complicated system and one i dont fully understand yet. parts are more expensive. from what i read here, the Bosch FI system is durable.
My kids coupe had a dual point ignition. this is a serious PITA. plan on ridding yourself of that right away.
The final consideration is how important is it to have the wifey buy in to this project and is the automatic required to make that happen.
The 75 will have smog stuff on it. most can be eliminated if you dont have to pass emissions. Outside of that, the cars are pretty much the same.