Just got my first Spider

[70spider]

Hello Everyone,
I just picked up a 1970 124 Spider , drove it 165miles to get it home. It was a bit rough, almost overheated (supsect thermostat), ran into a hail storm with 40mph winds, ripped top, no wipers, no turn signals, and a major backfire problem. After rough trip I got him home without having to call for a tow truck. Now time to restore it. My first step is to address the malfunctioning electricals then the engine. About the engine I was thinking about buying a 1608 from Midwest-Bayless and rebuild the lower end and then put a Vick's Autosport performance head on it. Nothing to wild, just a bit more power than the 1438. I was wondering if this is a straight forward swap? I know I'll need to get and intake manifold and the 1608's bellhousing (so far haven't located one), besides that anything else I might need?
Any advice would be appriciated.
Thanks

[RRoller123]

Welcome aboard! You will find plenty of knowledgeable and friendly people here.

Here is a thread on how to post pictures directly to the forum:

http://www.fiatspider.com/f08/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=21014

And here is another picture-posting thread:

http://www.fiatspider.com/f08/viewtopic ... 12&t=23084


Pete

[So Cal Mark]

congrats on the purchase and making it home it one piece

[vandor]

Sounds like it was quite an adventure!

The 1608 is a good choice, as it is the same family of engines as the 1438, so it's lighter than the larger engines.
Where are you located? I have a 1608 engine in Texas, it was running when I removed it, so I know there are no 'tragedies' inside If you are close to Bayless then it would make sense to get it from them.
A performance head won't make quite as big a difference as on the larger engines, because of the smaller displacement, but it will help. Why not get the head from Bayless too if you get the engine?

I had an 1800 intake on my 1608 with a 32/36DFEV carb, and it ran very well. I had a 2 liter from my wrecked Spider, so eventually I installed that.

[deftone]

Sounds like it was quite an adventure!

The 1608 is a good choice, as it is the same family of engines as the 1438, so it's lighter than the larger engines.
Where are you located? I have a 1608 engine in Texas, it was running when I removed it, so I know there are no 'tragedies' inside If you are close to Bayless then it would make sense to get it from them.
A performance head won't make quite as big a difference as on the larger engines, because of the smaller displacement, but it will help. Why not get the head from Bayless too if you get the engine?

I had an 1800 intake on my 1608 with a 32/36DFEV carb, and it ran very well. I had a 2 liter from my wrecked Spider, so eventually I installed that.

Where in Texas you located Csaba? I never realized you were here. If the OP doesnt want the engine I may talk to you about it

[deftone]

Hello Everyone,
I just picked up a 1970 124 Spider , drove it 165miles to get it home. It was a bit rough, almost overheated (supsect thermostat), ran into a hail storm with 40mph winds, ripped top, no wipers, no turn signals, and a major backfire problem.

And it gets more difficult from the first day....

Welcome to spider ownership, looking forward to seeing some pics. I am also an early spider owner

[70spider]

Vandor,
Thanks for the offer, I live in southeast Kansas and ship from Bayless is $355 making the total cost 1,100. So, the question is how much would you want for the 1608? By the way, what other parts might I need to complete the swap?
About the head, I couldn't find a performance one on Bayless, VAS has one prebuilt. Plus I have rebuilt the lower end on a Ford 302 a long day ago, so I feel comfortable tackling it, but never a head so I'll leave that to the experts.
Thanks again for the offer, you can PM me with the price .
I'll have pics up in a couple of days, rain and snow here at the moment.
Pesto

[narfire]

When you were describing your trip and the weather, I thought you were in the pacific north west....Daily occurrence there..

A suggestion.... why not source a second engine (1608) drop that in and take the head from the 1438 and ship it off for some work. I believe they are virtually the same head. After market cams, adjustable cam wheels perhaps, and then swap that onto the 1608 block with perhaps the 32/36 carb when you are ready.
oh yea...welcome. This is a great source of info and as you might notice...opinions
Chris

[70spider]

Narfire,
Thanks for the tip. If the heads are the same thats a great idea, save me some cash for sure. I'll research it. I test drove a couple of spiders before buying this one. The one I liked the most was a 71 w/1608 that had performance cams and it was awesome, however when I opened the hood after my test drive there was coolent pooling on the intake and running down the block and I knew it would not last the trip home so I didn't get it even though the body was 100% rust free, I would have got it if I had a trailer (I think it is the one that got away ). Any way thanks for the advice.
Pesto

[vandor]

70Spider,

I'd want $300 for the engine. I'll send you a PM.

Deftone,

I am in Colleyville, just West of DFW airport. I've been to most of the local club meets, and will go to the Hillcountry tour this coming weekend. I'd be great if you could make it, there will be ~30 Spiders there!

[deftone]

70Spider,

I'd want $300 for the engine. I'll send you a PM.

Deftone,

I am in Colleyville, just West of DFW airport. I've been to most of the local club meets, and will go to the Hillcountry tour this coming weekend. I'd be great if you could make it, there will be ~30 Spiders there!

Unfortunatly I am in Kazakhstan right now, so cannot make the tour

[bradartigue]

Hello Everyone,
I just picked up a 1970 124 Spider , drove it 165miles to get it home. It was a bit rough, almost overheated (supsect thermostat), ran into a hail storm with 40mph winds, ripped top, no wipers, no turn signals, and a major backfire problem. After rough trip I got him home without having to call for a tow truck. Now time to restore it. My first step is to address the malfunctioning electricals then the engine. About the engine I was thinking about buying a 1608 from Midwest-Bayless and rebuild the lower end and then put a Vick's Autosport performance head on it. Nothing to wild, just a bit more power than the 1438. I was wondering if this is a straight forward swap? I know I'll need to get and intake manifold and the 1608's bellhousing (so far haven't located one), besides that anything else I might need?
Any advice would be appriciated.
Thanks

Buy the head and the motor from the same place, and do some research here and elsewhere on vendors before you start spending your money. I like that you're talking about addressing the electrical first; get things sorted out before doing anything major mechanical. Get to know the car.

There is another thread here about the 1438 motor and should it be replaced, etc. This forum has a heavy tilt towards near radical modification of the cars; you would be well suited to search elsewhere and combine your research from all sources to make decisions about engine swaps. The 1438 is not some disappointing hunk of garbage and take the opinions as you will - very few people here or elsewhere have ever driven a 1438, much less one in good mechanical shape, and even fewer with good performance modifications. It is a high-revving, free spinning devil that you can enjoy high RPM shifting unlike any other Spider.

[bradartigue]

When you were describing your trip and the weather, I thought you were in the pacific north west....Daily occurrence there..

A suggestion.... why not source a second engine (1608) drop that in and take the head from the 1438 and ship it off for some work. I believe they are virtually the same head. After market cams, adjustable cam wheels perhaps, and then swap that onto the 1608 block with perhaps the 32/36 carb when you are ready.
oh yea...welcome. This is a great source of info and as you might notice...opinions
Chris

The heads are not the same, the ports on the 1438cc head are 30% or more smaller than the 1608cc and about 1/2 of the 1438cc heads (early heads) lack a coolant passageway that all later heads have.

[70spider]

Vandor,
Thanks for the great price, I emailed you.

Bradartigue,
I thought the heads were different from doing some research. Thanks for the input.

WOW! I think this is the best, most honest forum I have ever been on Great advice.

Pesto

[70spider]

Hello All,
Here are the pics I took for posterity sake. And yes the odometer is correct. Just wondering if paying $2,500 was to much, but it sure is a blast to drive.









Thanks for viewing and comments and advice is welcomed. Pesto